30 thoughts on “Food Babe Selling “Toxic” Product: Nutiva Chia Seeds”

1. While I don’t disagree with the post, the number is 1.016mg, not 1016mg. Gotta watch those decimal points.

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   • Thanks for reading and commenting. The unit of measure is listed as (g) in the left column, which would be grams. So 1.016 grams, or 1016mg, is correct. This appears to be standard for the amino acids, while the vitamins are listed in milligrams and micrograms. The column headers are unfortunately clipped off because this is a snippet from a very large data sheet and they didn’t reiterate the column headers in each section. If you follow the link in the references (also below) and expand the amino acids section, you can see what I mean:

     http://ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/foods/show/3643?fg=&man=&lfacet=&count=&max=&sort=&qlookup=&offset=&format=Stats&new=&measureby=

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2. Reblogged this on Illuminutti and commented:
   Food Babe’s hypocrisy . . .

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3. This is worthless quibbling. While a chia seed may contain this amino acid, the listed ingredient is the chia seed itself. This post does not in any way debunk whether food with this amino acid added as its own ingredient is indeed potentially unsafe food as you say she claims.

   It seems you like tearing down and Hari. I’d be interested in what you build up. She gets things done on food safety. You post on WordPress quibbling about what is in seeds. LOL!

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   • OK Curtis, let me explain this to you slowly: Vani is the one that says the ingredient is dangerous, not me. It’s her claim. You were given full references to her claim. Did you not read them?

     // She gets things done on food safety //

     Does she really? What, exactly? She’s selling exactly what she says is dangerous. The only difference between the products Vani says are dangerous and those she sells is that she earns a profit from the latter.

     Again, you really should try reading the article before commenting 🙂 Vani is the one “quibbling” about phenylalanine. Not me. Have you not read her articles? She says it’s dangerous. And she sells the same.

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     • She singlehandedly had yoga mat fluffer removed from Subway’s bread. She also forced them to commit to removing antibiotics from their chicken. And she’s going after the beef and pork next. All I’ve seen on your blog is drivel about mustard seeds, chia seeds, and a company that packages stuff she doesn’t sell with a chemical she thinks is bad. Really? Come on.

       Like I said, she’s out there getting things done. I’m really glad more people listen to her than to you. She’s making the world a safer place to eat. I’m going to buy some of her Chia seeds to support her work.

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       • So you challenge me to a debate and then won’t answer the points presented to you? Let’s try it again:

         She said phenylalanine is dangerous. She is selling a product laden with phenylalanine.

         Over two dozen products sold by Food Babe have the same ingredients she says are dangerous. Your turn. Would appreciate you staying on topic. How is it dangerous if she sells it? Is she selling you something that’s dangerous? She says it is.

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4. Why no acceptance on the contrary opinion? Like to dish it but can’t take it huh? You should change the Blog name from “Bad Science Debunked” to just “Bad”.

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   • Contrary opinions are most welcome here, and I do hope you’ll come back with more. It’s very rare to find a Vani Hari fan willing to stand up for her, given the fact that most everything she sells contains EXACTLY the same thing she says is dangerous.

     So, now that you’re here, let’s see you “dish it out”. Vani says phenylalanine is dangerous. She sells products that contain phenylalanine. Defend her, please.

     I’m assuming you’re comment on “no acceptance” is because your comment didn’t appear automatically? That’s a WordPress protection against spam. If you don’t like it, you’ll have to talk to them. It’s a feature built into all WordPress blogs, not just mine.

     But back to Vani… let’s start going through her product line, TOGETHER, and look at what she’s selling. When you’re done with phenylalanine, you’ve got at least two dozen more products ahead of you. All of them contain exactly what she says is dangerous. Up for the challenge Curtis?

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     • From the limited snippets you have quoted here, she seems to be saying that seeing this ingredient listed is a guidepost to toxins and GMO, and that by avoiding that added ingredient you can better avoid eating genetically modified organisms. She didn’t say “watch out for chia seeds”. She said “look out for and steer clear of x additive” as a general rule.

       Dissecting mustard seeds and chia seeds into their molecular components and then pretending she is a hypocrite based on quibbling shouldn’t be necessary. If you dislike the woman, face her head on, and quit wasting time dissecting the molecular makeup of seeds.

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       • Nope. If you want to debate, all I ask of you is honesty.

         What Food Babe said is that phenylalanine is dangerous. She also said erucic acid is dangerous (you switched articles on me, you crafty devil!)

         Food Babe sells products that contain phenylalanine. Food Babe sells products that contain erucic acid.

         If those two are dangerous, then why is she selling them?

         // Dissecting mustard seeds and chia seeds into their molecular components and then pretending she is a hypocrite based on quibbling shouldn’t be necessary //

         Oh yes it should. Your idol “dissected” rapeseed to come up with the claim that erucic acid is poisonous. Those are her claims. The mustard seeds she sells also contain erucic acid. Why is it poison in the products she doesn’t want you to buy, but not poisonous in the products she’s selling? Same acid.

         Your turn.

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5. I’m not going to climb down to the molecular makup of the salad dressing with you Aaron. It is pointless, which was my point.

   So what do you build up? Or do you just tear people down and call that building something? Vani Hari takes on Subway and wins, to my benefit and yours (if you ever buy Subway) and everyone else that eats there. In her book, she appears to make some generalizations based on her claimed research, and you take her on by pretending that the molecular makeup of ingredients are ingredients in and of themselves. Which is false. And then you build up an argument based on that foundation of falsehood. So we needn’t dissect the rest of your argument, but rather can just stop at saying that a Chia seed is not phenylalanine. That’s it. So because the ingredient list on the product she sells lists “chia seeds”, she isn’t selling something with phenylalanine added. Because if phenylalanine had been added it would be listed in the ingredients.

   We can take your logic and call all kinds of people hypocrites. Like our government health departments. Here goes: Apples have arsenic in them. The government said that arsenic is bad. And yet they tell us to eat apples! The hypocrites want to kill us! Avoid apples! Or continue eating apples and simply join me in tearing down the government and the world will be made better….

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   • First and foremost Curtis, thank you for sticking around to debate. Few of Hari’s fans will do so, and she bans everyone who disagrees with her, so it’s impossible to engage her on her page. I appreciate the conversation.

     You wrote:

     //So because the ingredient list on the product she sells lists “chia seeds”, she isn’t selling something with phenylalanine added.//

     You seem confused about phenylalanine, perhaps because Hari is. It is NOT “added” to products. Not the ones she disparages (like aspartame). Not to chia seeds. It’s an essential amino acid, found in many places.

     If phenylalanine is dangerous as Hari claims, then it is dangerous. Full stop. It doesn’t matter where it comes from. That’s my direct challenge to you, and you haven’t answered. So I’ll put it to you again: (1) is it dangerous or isn’t it? (2) if it’s dangerous as she says, why is she selling it?

     This argument also applies to erucic acid, which you’ve touched on. She says it’s poisonous, and dissects the chemical makeup of rapeseed (what you refer to as “looking at the molecular structure”) to make her case. I’ll leave that double standard aside for now, and stick to the point: mustard seeds contain just as much erucic acid as the rapeseed Vani disparages. How is her erucic acid not as dangerous?

     She says aluminum in deodorants is harmful, yet she sells a deodorant (Naturally Fresh) that contains aluminum. She warns about so-called endocrine disruptors (e.g., dimethicone) in cosmetics yet nearly every cosmetic she sells contains the same endocrine disruptors. She claims that sodium benzoate and vitamin C will give you leukemia, then sells products that contain sodium benzoate and vitamin C. Hari tells us that putting vitamin A on your skin and going into the sun will give you skin cancer, but she sells skin care products that contain vitamin A. Many of the products she sells contain IARC group 2B carcinogens–that’s the same list she pulled “4-Mel” from in her Starbucks campaign.

     So, it’s HARI that’s breaking down products and claiming the ingredients are dangerous. Why are the ingredients not dangerous in her products, but dangerous in the ones she’s warning about? Anxiously awaiting your answer.

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6. I have not read her book and don’t intend to. I am a huge fan of her social activism which has obvious positive results which you keep not discussing, and instead only focusing on nitpicking specific ingredients. So OK, let’s focus on what she said.

   In this case, after you forced me to go read her blog on gum, I found out two things:

   1) If you want to chew gum, “Spry” brand has an ingredient list that, while not great, is better than most. But chewing fennel seeds is much better for you and also helps with your breath. (The horror!)

   2) That you disingenuously misquoted her regarding phenylalanine. The dire warning you misrepresented above about serious health consequences sits directly below a huge picture of a label that says “PHENYLKETONURICS – CONTAINS PHENYLALANINE” in bold.

   As I’m sure you were aware, Phenylketonurics, or those suffering from Phenylketonuria (PKU), cannot synthesize phenylalanine. Here is a quote about it from fooducate.com:

   People suffering from Phenylketonuria (or PKU) are called phenylketonurics. Their body can’t metabolize synthesize phenylalanine. As it builds up in the body, it causes all sorts of bad things to happen, such as mental retardation, seizures, and other brain damage.

   So after accepting the dire warning stuff for what it is in context, which is a dire warning, we are left only with the notion that ““If a non-organic packaged good has [phenylalanine as an ingredient] it could be GMO or genetically engineered. I appreciate this warning.

   An the balance, since the rest of her article on gum was informative and helpful, I will avoid products with phenylalanine as an ingredient as an easy way to avoid eating genetically modified organisms. I will not bother researching whether this claim is 100% true, because it would be more worth my time to read a different article on good vs crappy salad dressing or something. Instead, I’ll just avoid anything with “phenylalanine” on the label.

   Which means that chia seeds are good to go.

   Thanks Food Babe!

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   • Thanks again for responding Curtis. Because Vani censors all dissenting comments on her web site, it’s extremely rare to be able to have an honest discussion with one of her followers. I wish more of them would visit here.

     To respond to your points:

     // That you disingenuously misquoted her regarding phenylalanine //

     Of course I didn’t disingenuously quote her. I gave the entire quote. I understand phenylketonuria very well–well enough to know Vani doesn’t explain it! She uses it as a scare tactic (read her quote) to drive people away from phenylalanine. Which brings us right back to the point I’ve kindly asked you to debate three times now: if Vani claims phenylalanine is dangerous (to anyone), why is she selling products that contain it? Do you see the same dire warnings on her products? Why won’t you address this point? What is different in the phenylalanine sold by Vani and the phenylalanine she says is dangerous?

     // I am a huge fan of her social activism which has obvious positive results which you keep not discussing,//

     I’ve seen no positive results from her “activism”. I’ve given you at least a half dozen solid examples of cases where her “activism” is nothing more than fear mongering designed to sell her own products that contain the same ingredients she says are dangerous. You won’t address these. Why?

     Why is it OK for Vani to sell foods containing erucic acid when she says it’s poisonous?

     Why is it OK for her to sell aluminum-based deodorants in an article where she links those same deodorants to Alzheimer’s?

     What’s the difference in the dimethicone and other “endocrine disruptors” in the cosmetics sold by Vani, and the same additives in the cosmetics she tells her followers not to buy?

     Here’s a good one for you: the dyes Yellow 5 and Blue 1 she says are dangerous? They’re used throughout the full line of Tarte lip stains she sells, along with aluminum (she says is toxic), dimethicone (toxic!), and saccharine (cancer, according to Vani). How is she “making a difference”?

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7. You need to quit disingenuously and (perhaps deliberately?) misquoting Ms. Hari here. This is what you yourself have quoted her as saying:

   “Phenylalanine is added to the ingredient Aspartame and could seriously be dangerous if you have certain health conditions.”

   With the benefit of the context which you left out seemingly on purpose, the “certain health condition” she is referring to is PKU. We are certain of this because she goes on to list the symptoms associated with consumption of phenylalanine by someone with PKU:

   “Consuming this substance (if you have a condition that makes you sensitive to this additive) can cause mental retardation, brain seizures, sleep disorders and anxiety.”

   So it wasn’t Ms. Hari that was misleading anyone here. It was you.

   Why do you keep saying that she claims that “phenylalanine is dangerous (to anyone)” when in fact she does not, but rather indicates that it is dangerous if you have certain health conditions (true) and a good guide to avoiding GMO (true in the case of the gum she covered, and a harmless opinion even if it isn’t always true).

   If you knew she was talking about PKU, which you acknowledge that you did when you told everyone that “[you] understand phenylketonuria very well”, then it follows that you deliberately hid the fact that you knew her to be discussing the symptoms of a certain health condition called PKU, and disingenuously mislead your readers into this rabbit trail on chia seeds.

   Shame on you. You don’t need to mislead and conduct meaningless witch hunts in order to better society. You should better target your intelligence next time.

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   • OK Curtis, I keep answering your questions directly, and you’re ignoring mine. I’ll answer your charge on the misquote (again), but first I’d like you to respond to something I’ve asked you four times already:

     How is the phenylalanine sold by Vani Hari any different than the phenylalanine she says is dangerous?

     How is the erucic acid sold by Hari different than that in the products she says are dangerous?

     how is the aluminum in deodorants sold by Hari different than the aluminum in deodorants she says causes Alzheimer’s?

     How are the “endocrine disruptors” such as dimethicone in cosmetics sold by Hari different than the dimethicone in cosmetics she tells her followers not to buy?

     How are the dyes Yellow #5 and Blue #1 sold by Hari different than the Yellow #5 and Blue #1 she tells her followers to avoid?

     Again, I’m happy to answer your charges about the supposed quote mining, but a conversation needs to work both ways. You seem to be unable/unwilling to address the fact that Hari is selling exactly what she says is dangerous.

     Why won’t you answer?

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8. You asked: How is the phenylalanine sold by Vani Hari any different than the phenylalanine she says is dangerous?

   Quit disingenuously implying that Vani Hari said that phenylalanine is dangerous to everyone. She said it could be dangerous if you have certain health conditions (PKU). It is YOU that said she said it is dangerous to everyone. Building on this misrepresentation, you wandered into chia seeds of all things, and emerged with this false hypocrisy as a conclusion. But you don’t get to have that conclusion because your premise was completely false.

   I’m not going to address any of your other purported premises because you have discredited yourself on this one. Why read the mustard seed conspiracy after researching the chia seed conspiracy at your great urging, and finding that you misrepresented the foundation of your own claim?

   The only thing left for you to argue here is that Vani Hari is wrong when she makes this claim:

   “If a non-organic packaged good has [phenylalanine in it then] it could be GMO or genetically engineered. Look for Non-GMO Project certified products and ingredients that are listed as 100% organic on labels to avoid all GMOs in your diet.”

   But I don’t care if she is wrong in making this claim because I already avoid GMO’s in my diet, and it is a trivial claim regardless.

   There is nothing more to discuss here Mark. You appear to have believed you were building this seed conspiracy on a rock foundation when in fact you were building it on quicksand.

   I for one believe that contrary to your claim, you did not in fact know about PKU, which was why you expanded her warning “to all people” and built your argument. In this case you are better off just admitting you didn’t know that she was addressing PKU and retaining what was left of your credibility. But you instead indicated that you did know what PKU is, which implies that you knowingly mislead your audience. So either you lied about “dangerous to everyone” or you lied in saying that you knew what PKU is. In either case, I see no point in arguing about mustard seeds with you, because you might lie.

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   • // You asked: How is the phenylalanine sold by Vani Hari any different than the phenylalanine she says is dangerous? Quit disingenuously implying that Vani Hari said that phenylalanine is dangerous to everyone. //

     It’s astounding you can’t or won’t answer the question, Curtis. How is the phenylalanine different? It’s the same ingredient. Hari sells it. Why is hers OK? Fifth time I’ve asked.

     // Building on this misrepresentation, you wandered into chia seeds of all things, //

     I “wandered” into chia seeds because they most definitely contain phenylalanine, and Hari sells at least two different brands. How is her phenylalanine different? Still waiting for an answer.

     Why is the aluminum in the deodorant she sells OK, when she says aluminum in deodorants is dangerous?

     Why are the dyes in her products safe when she says the same dyes are dangerous in products sold by Kraft, Nestle, etc?

     Why is dimethicone in Hari’s cosmetics OK when she says it’s bad in others?

     You’re desperately trying to dodge on a silly phenylalanine/GMO issue. Phenylalanine is an essential amino acid. Hari was clueless when she said it was “added” to artificial sweeteners. You’re beating the red herring really hard here, trying to avoid answering how it’s OK for Vani to sell something she says are dangerous.

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9. Mark: “You’re desperately trying to dodge on a silly phenylalanine/GMO issue.”

   LOL! Your entire blog post was on a silly phenylalanine issue. You lied and told everyone that the food babe said it was dangerous when in fact she did not.

   You then wrote this silly trash based entirely on your original lie. The only thing in your blog post that wasn’t based on a lie was the GMO issue. What else is there?

   You keep saying that Vani Hari says phenylalanine is dangerous to everyone, which is your own false premise. But since it is false you need to stop saying it. Don’t you see why it is important that you stop lying?

   As I said, I’m not going to discuss aluminum or mustard seeds or anything else because you may have (I’m beginning to think likely) lied in your blog posts on those too. And it’s not worth fact checking your work.

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   • Food Babe did say it was dangerous, and you were given the full quote. Dishonesty does not sit well on you, my friend.

     You still haven’t answered why it’s OK for her to sell it. I never said she said it was dangerous to “everyone”. Prove me wrong. That’s a direct challenge. To help you get started, here’s what I wrote:

     “Yikes! Brain seizures and mental retardation from phenylalanine, an essential amino acid? Well, if you suffer from the rare disorder known as phenylketonuria (PKU), it could indeed be a problem.”

     Now, you still haven’t explained why it’s OK for Vani to sell phenylalanine when she says others shouldn’t. What are you afraid of Curtis? Explain to me why it’s OK for Vani to sell phenylalanine. Or erucic acid.

     // As I said, I’m not going to discuss aluminum or mustard seeds or anything else because you //

     Honestly Curtis, I think you’re afraid to discuss these because you know in advance what you’ll find. Every single charge I made is true. If you don’t care enough to do the reading, that’s up to you. That’s how Vani makes her money. She knows YOU won’t read the product labels of what she’s selling. That’s how she sells you an aluminum-based deodorant in an article where she says such things are dangerous.

     So do us both a favor. Stay around and have an honest discussion. Here’s the aluminum link. You think I’m wrong? Prove it. Please. That’s how science works.

     Food Babe Pushing “Dangerous” Items: Naturally Fresh Deodorant

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10. No Mark. You are trying to distract from your own false premise. What does it matter that she sells chia seeds if she only said that phenylalanine is dangerous to people with certain conditions and that seeing it in the ingredient list is a good guidepost to GMO?

    Phenylalanine is not in the ingredient list of the chia seeds she sells. It is in the ingredient list of the gum she says to avoid, because of the presence of aspartame and GMO.

    You keep repeating and repeating and repeating again your false assertion that she said that phenylalanine is bad for everyone, even though she didn’t, and then attempt to distract us with the question of “how is it OK for her to sell _______ when she says that it is dangerous?

    Going back to your debunked lie of “when she says that it is dangerous” is a no go zone my friend. And that is why it is perfectly fine for her to sell chia seeds.

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    • // Phenylalanine is not in the ingredient list of the chia seeds she sells //

      Phenylalanine IS in the chia seeds she sells. I’ll ask you for the ninth time now: how is her phenylalanine any less dangerous?

      // You keep repeating and repeating and repeating again your false assertion that she said that phenylalanine is bad for everyone //

      No, I didn’t, and I gave you the exact quote. Here is the quote again:

      “Yikes! Brain seizures and mental retardation from phenylalanine, an essential amino acid? Well, if you suffer from the rare disorder known as phenylketonuria (PKU), it could indeed be a problem.”

      How about a little honesty Curtis? I’ve answered each and every charge you’ve made. Along with full quotes. You still, after nine requests, have not even attempted to explain how the phenylalanine, erucic acid, aluminum, artificial dyes, saccharine, sodium benzoate + vitamin C, or dimethicone sold by Vani Hari are any less dangerous than the very same in the products she’s trashing.

      I’d love to get into the silliness of an essential amino acid being a “gmo guidepost” with you–and I will. But first I think you owe me the same honesty I’m giving you. I’ve answered your charges. Now please answer mine. Explain how the the phenylalanine, erucic acid, aluminum, artificial dyes, saccharine, sodium benzoate + vitamin C, or dimethicone sold by Food Babe is less dangerous.

      I can’t force you to do this, but you said you came here for honest discourse. So now would be the time.

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11. Mark,

    You have provided no honesty at all. You keep returning to a debunked claim that she said phenylalanine is dangerous, which she didn’t. So the rest of what you are trying to build up by talking about it being in chia seeds is completely meaningless.

    So to answer you question, for the ninth time:

    Mark: “how is her phenylalanine any less dangerous?”

    Here is my answer: Less dangerous than what?

    In your question, do you mean, “how is her phenylalanine any less dangerous than the phenylalanine that Mark lied about in falsely claiming she said it was dangerous?

    The answer is: you are chasing a non sequitur based on the debunked foundation of your own lie.
    Get over it.

    I have told you repeatedly why I am not willing to discuss erucic acid, aluminum, artificial dyes, saccharine, sodium benzoate + vitamin C, or dimethicone with you. Let me make it perfectly clear one more time though:

    YOU ARE A LIAR.

    I am therefore not going to investigate your other claims because you lied about the phenylalanine.

    YOU ARE DISCREDITED.

    So your other claims, valid as you may believe them to be, are not worth investigating because of this fact.

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    • Actually Curtis, you have Vani’s own quote about the dangers of phenylalanine in front of you, in context. You see her warning people away from a product that contains it, and you know she’s selling products that also contain it. It’s really that simple.

      I’m sure you’ve already checked the ingredients in Vani’s Naturally Fresh deodorant and discovered it contains aluminum, and you know she sells this deodorant in the same article where she says aluminum based deodorants are dangerous. I think THAT is why you won’t discuss it.

      If you HAVEN’T investigated the claims, you have no basis to be calling anyone a liar. That silly ad hom approach is how Vani Hari works. Go ahead, prove me wrong. Read the ingredients and show me there’s aluminum.

      What are you afraid of?

      Why are you not afraid to read Vani’s claim of poisonous Erucic acid in modified rapeseed but scared to read that mustard seeds contain as much of the same acid, and Vani’s selling products full of it?

      You’re copping out, Curtis. You challenged me to a debate based on facts and now you’re publicly saying you’re not going to even read the facts. Read the labels on Vani’s products and tell me how her Erucic acid, aluminum, or phenylalanine is any safer than the SAME chemicals in the products she says are dangerous.

      Read the labels Curtis. Show me where I’m “lying”. I dare you 🙂

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12. What a great debate but Curtis, you’re entirely missing the point. People with PKU cannot have phenylalanine due to the body’s inability to process it resulting in seizures etc. Because it is a genetic disorder,infants are tested for in via a heel prick Guthrie test. This blood test detects a number of different genetic disorders – PKU being one of them.

    The issue I have with Food Babe is her fear mongering. She states that anything listed with phenylalanine is GMO so must be avoided – her chia seeds won’t list phenylalanine as its not an added ingredient – its an amino acid within the seed itself. Just because it’s not listed on the packaging doesn’t mean that people with PKU can ingest chia seeds – quite the contrary. They still need to avoid chia seeds. I truly believe she has no grasp of scientific concepts. She picks up on ingredients (and in this instance a genetic disorder) but having accurate labeling that a product contains said ingredient makes it easier for those with PKU to avoid.

    That particular chewing gum article also makes a correlation that chewing gum must be bad for you because you can’t buy it in Singapore. Unfortunately, she fails to mention that Singapore has actually banned the chewing of gum – not because it’s bad but just because countries are able to make their own laws and visitors must comply with the laws or risk fines, jail sentences, deportation etc.

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13. Pingback: Food Babe’s Tricky Treats | Bad Science Debunked

14. I wish Curtis would have responded to you! I wanted to see if he could defend improper labeling.

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    • Same here Lakeshia. It’s ironic that on a blog that DOES NOT ban users and allows free discussion, Food Babe Army members won’t stick around for discussion. Yet if you try to have the same conversation on Food Babe’s site(s), you’re censored and banned 😦

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15. I am late with my comment, but I couldn’t resist. My sister has PKU and she must abstain from phenylalanine, which is in just about everything!!!! Trust me, if you abstained from phenylalanine, you would be a vegetarian, but heck corn even contains phenylalanine!!!! Phenylalanine is an amino acid in the protein chain. If you don’t have PKU, you are ingesting it daily and it’s safe.

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